One Nation Under Epicurus

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This is a guest post by Sam Riviera. He spends most of his time and energy caring for others in his community so that through his life and actions they might see Jesus. He has also written “14 Reasons I Never Returned to the Institutional Church.

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EpicurusThose of us Christians who live in the USA often pride ourselves in our “Christian” form of government, and believe that our Constitution and indeed many of our laws are based on Christian principles. Some of us believe that our laws should reflect the teachings of the Bible, or what we suppose the teachings of the Bible to be.

Therefore we conclude that our “Christian” duty includes voting for politicians who will enact such laws, and when given the opportunity, we must support and vote for those laws.

Over two thousand two hundred years ago the philosopher Epicurus proposed that the gods, if they actually exist, do not concern themselves with humans and what they do. As N. T. Wright suggests in his most recent book, How God Became King, “…As a result, the world we know grows, changes, and develops under its own steam, as it were from within… Apply this to political science and you get democracy: society ordering itself according to its own internal wishes and whims, fears and fancies” (p. 35).

Is America a Christian Nation?

The foremost question before us therefore is this: Is our society indeed “a Christian nation,” based on the principles of Scripture, or a society that has ordered itself according to its own wishes, which only gives a passing nod to Scripture and to God? Are we one nation under God?

Who is our king? Is it God, or our system — a system which functions according to our wishes and whims?

When we support or oppose certain candidates and issues, do we do it because we suppose we are supporting “God’s agenda” (as we may be told by political parties, politicians and even religious leaders), or are we actually supporting one political agenda over another? Do our politicians attempt to bring about a “Christian society” through their actions and the laws they enact, or do they only pretend to do so to get the votes and support of the “Christian” segment of the population?

When we seek to order ourselves and our society, is God really our king? Have we not made ourselves king and supposed that we can solve our problems with our system of government?

Have we succeeded in legislating “God’s law,” or even achieved a society based on religious principles?

Is our system indeed Christian, or more likely modeled on the philosophy of Epicurus, who few, if any, would describe as religious?

I look forward to interacting with you on these questions in the comments below.

For those reading this who would like to comment, please refrain from praising or bashing any specific political party, political figure or political issue. Let us think about whether our political system is based on the Bible, as some of us have been led to believe, or on a philosophy where God is largely absent.


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  • http://missionallendale.wordpress.com/ Joey Espinosa

    “Have we succeeded in legislating God’s law?” I love that line.

    I wrote a parallel post last month, after reading a short book called “America Upon His Shoulders.” When people claim that America is a “Christian” nation, I think they are making some big leaps in logic.

    http://differentway4kids.blogspot.com/2012/07/christian-america.html

    • Sam

      Great post, Joey! I’ve been thinking about the “moral decline of America” and remember things in the 50′s, 60′s, 70′s and 80′s that were given as examples of the “moral decline” of those decades. For most of those things, it has been many, many years since I have heard anyone mention them as examples of “moral decline”.

      I wonder – Have we become oblivious to things that are now accepted as the norm, but once were not, or have we decided that many of these things simply reflected the thinking of conservative religious folks of an earlier era and now our opinion has changed? Just a couple (of many) examples – In the 50′s many grocery stores closed on Sundays, and most Christians would not engage in any sports on Sundays. When those things began changing, I heard that described as examples of the “moral decline”. The last time I heard that was at least fifty years ago.

      What do you think?

      • http://missionallendale.wordpress.com/ Joey Espinosa

        That’s a good thought. As I live in the “Bible belt,” many of these “blue laws” still exist. And even if they don’t exist, many church-goers still think they should.

        I do think there is a grave danger in speaking where the Bible is silent, whether it’s not selling groceries on Sunday, or not healing a paralyzed man on the Sabbath. Do you think the Pharisees thought Jesus was leading people on a “moral decline”?

        • Sam

          Probably. After all, Jesus partied with sinners, let women of poor reputation wash his feet and so on. Many of the religious folks had to have been shocked. I think many “Christians” today would be shocked at what he would do if he showed up and walked among us for a few years. I seriously doubt he’d be preaching at mega church stadium events.

          • http://www.facebook.com/taco.verhoef Taco Verhoef

            He might go in and kick the money tables around. And in doing so he might call them vipers and such kind of foul language that is not tolerated in church so there would of course be some big elders of security guards escorting him out of the building. I don’t live in the USA but for I don’t believe in politics any more so I don’t vote. I think the democracie system is very corrupt and has noting to do with God and Jesus.

          • Sam

            Joey and Taco – This is just my opinion, but I doubt Jesus would be asked to speak. “So you think you’re Jesus? You’re some kind of nut case. Everyone knows the Son of God wouldn’t hang out with prostitutes and the scum of the earth.” I think most religious folks would think Jesus had lots of wild, crazy and dangerous ideas. That’s what they thought the first time he showed up.

          • http://missionallendale.wordpress.com/ Joey Espinosa

            Well, he might preach a mega church events. After all, think of all the times he preached to the masses from a hill.

  • john

    it is interesting i just watched a movie called Time Changer and it was a movie based off a christian professor in the 1890′s who was going to write a book about using the moral teachings of Jesus, but without mentioning Jesus. The other professor debated with him that if taught the teachings without the authority of Jesus that basically you would have a godless nation who lived very good, the man shows this professor by zapping him into the year 2000 and where Christ as authority is almost non existant. It is a very good movie, of course i am not explaining it the best i could but this is the some of what i understood.

    • Sam

      John, I haven’t seen that movie, but it sound interesting. After watching it and thinking about its message, do you have an opinion of what kind of nation this is?